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Conclusion about .com, .mobi and .tel

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Telnic
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Conclusion about .com, .mobi and .tel

Post by Telnic on Tue 30 Dec 2014, 12:53 pm

mactel03-01-2010 07:30 PM




Conclusion about .com, .mobi and .tel
 
.
Conclusion about .com, .mobi and .tel

Quote from „Ms Domainer“ (NamesPros):
„It took 10-12 years (from 1985) for .com to take off; at first, no one knew what to do with the internet or how to monetize it. In fact, if I recall correctly, there were purists out there who felt that the internet should not be commercial at all. It WILL take a while for .tel, and it WILL take a major investment by another company and lots of advertising. Or something very clever that will send .tel into going viral (perhaps a bit like winning the lottery).“

Ok: And I say: 
.mobi has not failed. And neither has .biz failed. Which is why both are „ a buy“, and a good investment (but only, if the domain, inclusive extension looks „cool“).
.tel is a very promissing domain, with a promissing future.
.eco might be real, some day, as well, and so what?: Oportunity for profits? Sure.
Even .gay, if that should happen.

Conclusion:
The longer you keep .tel alive, within the „10 year period“, the better for .tel, and for your success.

P.S.:
About domain sales: Do not sell a domain, if its extension is not at least five years old.
Domains get more desirable, the older they have "ripenend in the wine sellar". 
.

ArrisDottel03-01-2010 11:24 PM




Hello Mactel

I too seen the quote by Ms Domainer - Yes dot com did indeed take some time to take off. 

Once I had read the post it reminded me that dot tel was the fastest selling extension in the brief history of the internet.

With the progress made in terms of features over the last year - I'm sure the tel extension will have aged well in four - five years time.


henri03-02-2010 11:00 AM




The fundamental issue with .mobi is that it doesn't have any uniquely defining role.
Getting a .com or a .mobi makes absolutely no difference, except in the perception of the user who will think "ah, this is a mobile site". The easy ability of a .com to auto-switch to a mobile-friendly layout makes .mobi irrelevant for most applications (note that I say "most", not all). Only purely mobile plays will want .mobi domains, and what's really problematic these days is how much the concept of mobile has been both expanded and diluted with what once was "desktop" or "big screen".

When we designed .tel, it was absolutely critical to make it unique, and uniquely valuable, while retaining compatibility with the existing Internet architecture. Because of (or thanks to) the compatibility, you can do everything you do in a .tel with a .com. However, and this is where the unique value lies, with a .tel you're guaranteed that the data follows .tel specs, and just by seeing .tel you are certain that it's got that kind of data.
With a .com having ".tel-like" data in it, you have to say: "hello, this is a .com but it's also got contact info in it just like a .tel, so please go grab the NAPTR/TXT/LOC records that you would have otherwise missed. Oh, and take it on faith that the data has the correct structure because there's no guarantee. Good luck!"

And of course with a .com you'd have to enter all that info in some way, so you'd have to do quite a bit of work to replicate the TelHosting app. And finally, you'd have to also build your own little privacy system if you needed that (essentially encryption/decryption keys management).

mactel03-02-2010 11:56 AM




Quote:



Originally Posted by henri (Post 6000)
With a .com having ".tel-like" data in it, you have to say: "hello, this is a .com but it's also got contact info in it just like a .tel, so please go grab the NAPTR/TXT/LOC records that you would have otherwise missed."


[size]
Well, I agree with that.

Now tell only 1% of .com owners about that option.

If only 1/2% of .com owners would get a .tel domain, for that reason: I think, Telnic and all .tel followers would be done.

Conclusion:
You could do some nice .tel promotion for .com owners, and get some nice results, too, in return.

Simply tell owners of a .com domain, that if they get a .tel domain, and integrate it on their contact page: Making contact, will be a lot easyer, and a lot more fun, etc., etc.
.[/size]

JLouisBiz03-02-2010 12:40 PM




And I have to refute you in following points:

Quote:



Originally Posted by henri (Post 6000)
The fundamental issue with .mobi is that it doesn't have any uniquely defining role.


[size]
Yes, it does, the Dot MOBI does have uniquely defined role, and require domain owners to follow the guidelines and to have mobile websites. That is clearly uniquely defined role. It would be true, if you would be speaking about COM, NET, ORG, INFO. See MOBI on Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.mobi

In that manner: guidelines, rules, limitation, MOBI is very similar to TEL.

With TEL, domain owner need not think if the website will work or not, as TELNIC has prepared everything required, so websites simply work. Good.

But most certainly MOBI is not irrelevant in the domain market and such statement is simply not true. 

Now, I see you as co-creator or creator of TEL domain, as you work there in TELNIC, but I don't see a reason for making such unfounded statements, just to praise TEL domain. TEL domain is not a children's toy, and there is no need for "mine is better" cry.

Your marketing is already good enough. I agree that you shall remove your last message, and then remove this, mine message too, as I actually perceive your statements simply wrong, as you speak from TELNIC, you have position there. I am working on TEL and I can speak whatever I like with TEL domain owners, we can criticize it or praise it, but I don't think that TELNIC shall criticize competition, that make a bad image to TEL domain. 

Quote:
[/size]



Only purely mobile plays will want .mobi domains, and what's really problematic these days is how much the concept of mobile has been both expanded and diluted with what once was "desktop" or "big screen".


[size]
Who are purely mobile plays? What are you speaking about? Do you know that you put down those hundreds and thousands of owners of MOBI domains? You are trying to degrade MOBI owners and MOBI business, and praise your own business

http://www.uxpe.com/images/0a634f304...77960d6db4.png

Quote:
[/size]



However, and this is where the unique value lies, with a .tel you're guaranteed that the data follows .tel specs, and just by seeing .tel you are certain that it's got that kind of data.


[size]
Absolutely. But there is no need to put down others, your API is so far open, it could be open even more, and anyone could do the TEL stuff on .COM in the exact same manner. That is actually a step to be seen in the future. I can expect some software developers doing that.

But let us be honest, and say that unique value is only unique in the beginning, and it can be copied in shortest time, and COM can be just like TEL. But I don't see a reason to be limited like TEL.

Quote:
[/size]



With a .com having ".tel-like" data in it, you have to say: "hello, this is a .com but it's also got contact info in it just like a .tel, so please go grab the NAPTR/TXT/LOC records that you would have otherwise missed. Oh, and take it on faith that the data has the correct structure because there's no guarantee. Good luck!"


[size]
Nonsense.

I think you are programmer and you have your own views and position, and your views and positions are biased. That explains all. 

Putting data into DNS records is no magic stuff, and one could simply make up such software independently, and it could be even better in many ways, unlimited. Hosting providers could offer numerous DNS servers to people which would host such system. The time will tell. I don't find that feature yet interesting for myself, but someone might do that in future. 

But don't put down other unknown software developers, that is generalization. Biased generalization. It shall not come out of your typing fingers. Giving TEL or COM to someone with the software in his mobile phone takes same time and same efforts. 

Quote:
[/size]



And of course with a .com you'd have to enter all that info in some way, so you'd have to do quite a bit of work to replicate the TelHosting app. And finally, you'd have to also build your own little privacy system if you needed that (essentially encryption/decryption keys management).


[size]
As a programmer, you shall not sit in your ivory tower, but rather look around. What you are implying there is simply not true. You have probably worked on the TEL domain and you praise that into the sky. But that is simply not the manner to do that. Your marketing does the stuff, and your unqualified statements are biased and without any comparison.

There is no need to replicate TEL control panel, such CMSes exist in other CMS systems for years. Example comparison is here:http://www.cmsmatrix.org/

And making of simple recursive subdomains listings with records in it is certainly not a big deal for any of such CMS programmers. To build your privacy encrypted system? Man, that existed long before TEL domains.

Delete your message, then delete mine. It will be lesser shame.[/size]

henri03-02-2010 03:59 PM




Quote:



Originally Posted by JLouisBiz (Post 6007)
Yes, it does, the Dot MOBI does have uniquely defined role, and require domain owners to follow the guidelines and to have mobile websites. That is clearly uniquely defined role. It would be true, if you would be speaking about COM, NET, ORG, INFO. See MOBI on Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.mobi

In that manner: guidelines, rules, limitation, MOBI is very similar to TEL.



[size]
If you are to actually look at the .mobi developer's guide, you will note that there are no specific important requirements. That's normal because there is no way you can ever ensure that "a .mobi is guaranteed to work on your device." Unless you make a site totally text-based with no javascript, PNGs, etc..., good luck ensuring absolute compatibility.

Quote:
[/size]



Originally Posted by JLouisBiz (Post 6007)
With TEL, domain owner need not think if the website will work or not, as TELNIC has prepared everything required, so websites simply work. Good.


[size]
This statement is irrelevant to the discussion at hand, as .tel domains are not websites.

Quote:
[/size]



Originally Posted by JLouisBiz (Post 6007)
But most certainly MOBI is not irrelevant in the domain market and such statement is simply not true.


[size]
I have no idea whether or not .mobi is relevant in the domain market. I am interested in applications, and I said that .mobi was irrelevant for most (not all) applications. There is one area where .mobi is useful, which is when one wants, without doubt, to advertise the mobile focus of a site. In most real life cases, website owners will simply elect to modify their application's behavior depending on the perceived end user device and use a single entry point (be it .com, .de, etc...).

Quote:
[/size]



Originally Posted by JLouisBiz (Post 6007)
Now, I see you as co-creator or creator of TEL domain, as you work there in TELNIC, but I don't see a reason for making such unfounded statements, just to praise TEL domain. TEL domain is not a children's toy, and there is no need for "mine is better" cry.


[size]
I am not praising .tel domains, nor am I making unfounded statements. I am explaining the differences in concept behind .com, .mobi and .tel. I am not extolling the virtues of .tel, I'm saying why .tel is different. You are certainly free to disagree with my analysis of .mobi, but please refrain from personal attacks.

Quote:
[/size]



Originally Posted by JLouisBiz (Post 6007)
Your marketing is already good enough. I agree that you shall remove your last message, and then remove this, mine message too, as I actually perceive your statements simply wrong, as you speak from TELNIC, you have position there. I am working on TEL and I can speak whatever I like with TEL domain owners, we can criticize it or praise it, but I don't think that TELNIC shall criticize competition, that make a bad image to TEL domain.


[size]
Skipping some more .mobi "putting down" arguments...

Ah so you don't want me explaining why .mobi has a problem. It is not by hiding problems that you solve them, it's by identifying them and analyzing them for causality. I do not believe that .tel is in competition with .mobi, and neither did .mobi judging from our conversations a couple of years ago to see what could be done between our two companies. It is my job to analyze the markets and understand the forces moving them in order to maximize .tel's success for everyone involved.[/size]

henri03-02-2010 03:59 PM




Quote:



Originally Posted by JLouisBiz (Post 6007)
Absolutely. But there is no need to put down others, your API is so far open, it could be open even more, and anyone could do the TEL stuff on .COM in the exact same manner. That is actually a step to be seen in the future. I can expect some software developers doing that.
But let us be honest, and say that unique value is only unique in the beginning, and it can be copied in shortest time, and COM can be just like TEL. But I don't see a reason to be limited like TEL.



[size]
You clearly missed the point of the explanation as to why .tel is different than .com. I urge you to read again my earlier post:
Quote:
[/size]



Originally Posted by henri
with a .tel you're guaranteed that the data follows .tel specs, and just by seeing .tel you are certain that it's got that kind of data.


[size]
Quote:
[/size]



Originally Posted by JLouisBiz (Post 6007)
I think you are programmer and you have your own views and position, and your views and positions are biased. That explains all.


[size]
That's as good a tautology as one could imagine.

Quote:
[/size]



Originally Posted by JLouisBiz (Post 6007)
Putting data into DNS records is no magic stuff, and one could simply make up such software independently, and it could be even better in many ways, unlimited. Hosting providers could offer numerous DNS servers to people which would host such system. The time will tell. I don't find that feature yet interesting for myself, but someone might do that in future.


[size]
Oh but we do encourage this. In a short while you'll start having some registrars running their own TelHosting platform.

Quote:
[/size]



Originally Posted by JLouisBiz (Post 6007)
But don't put down other unknown software developers, that is generalization. Biased generalization. It shall not come out of your typing fingers. Giving TEL or COM to someone with the software in his mobile phone takes same time and same efforts.


[size]
Nowhere do I "put down" software developers. If software can be written, it can be replicated. I am not ever stating that .tel software cannot be replicated. What I am stating is that to replicate .tel value proposition you must have a dedicated top level domain. Using .com as a dual-purpose domain, where the absolute crushing majority of .com domains have absolutely no contact info in them, won't work. You can use something like .phone or .abc or anything else, but not .com.

Quote:
[/size]



Originally Posted by JLouisBiz (Post 6007)
As a programmer, you shall not sit in your ivory tower, but rather look around. What you are implying there is simply not true. You have probably worked on the TEL domain and you praise that into the sky. But that is simply not the manner to do that. Your marketing does the stuff, and your unqualified statements are biased and without any comparison.


[size]
I'd appreciate your toning down the personal attacks. Thank you.

Quote:
[/size]



Originally Posted by JLouisBiz (Post 6007)
There is no need to replicate TEL control panel, such CMSes exist in other CMS systems for years. [...]
And making of simple recursive subdomains listings with records in it is certainly not a big deal for any of such CMS programmers. To build your privacy encrypted system? Man, that existed long before TEL domains.



[size]
Hmm... maybe you should reconsider the complexity of mapping contact management to zonefiles, and then come back and discuss this. It's obviously very doable, but nowhere near as simple as you're implying.
As to privacy encryption, you're again missing the point. Imagine if each person in her own .com had to create her own friending system. It just wouldn't work. You'd need a centralized place to exchange privacy keys easily. Again, try to avoid looking at the technical problem and look instead at the usability issues. Visualize the forest and not the best way to grow the trees, so to speak.

Quote:
[/size]



Originally Posted by JLouisBiz (Post 6007)
Delete your message, then delete mine. It will be lesser shame.


[size]
I understand that English isn't your mother tongue, so I will disregard certain unnecessarily aggressive statements, but in the future please do try to mollify your writing when you're uncertain about how it will be perceived.

This is my last post on this matter, and I shall not respond in this thread again.
H[/size]

JLouisBiz03-02-2010 05:51 PM




But I will respond. This is open discussion forum, and I am certainly here because I am interested. Otherwise I would not be creating on TEL. I am speaking out, but if you don't like it, you may find it "aggressive", and unpleasant, but you can hardly ignore it.

TEL is your baby, I understand. I am working in preparation of investment projects and I understand that TEL required a lot in preparation, planning, details and great energy had to be spent to achieve the position where you are now.

Your messages can be understood as "official" because you are directly involved with TEL. On your place, I would rather post as anonymous, because statements like here simply don't promote TEL. That is why I seriously proposed to delete your and my messages. If you would be just a visitor or member, fine, but when you say TEL domain is not a website, it is utterly wrong.

Of course I see TEL is different then COM, but I don't need to agree on biased statements. 

Your position does depend of having the TLD, and that is powerful position. Worth to keep it and expand it. That is probably the greatest value that TELNIC has. Not the DNS storage, not the CMS, not the "unique point of contact". But having the TLD approved (and paid for it).

Quote:



.com as a dual-purpose domain, where the absolute crushing majority of .com domains have absolutely no contact info in them, won't work. You can use something like .phone or .abc or anything else, but not .com.


[size]
Funny. I really try to grasp how you think. COM is multi-purpose domain, and that is good so. 

Finally, until now, whatever COM website has offered goods and services, I was able to contact themCOM owner decides how he shall be contacted, by e-mail, postal mail, web form and so on. In the same manner TEL domain owner decides how to be contacted as well. 

Your statistics that COMs have generally no contact information is based on which research? Who said COM domains have absolutely no contact info in them? Where did you dig that out? 

How about 280,000 TEL domains and majority of them not having contact info in them? Maybe 60,000 have it, the 220,000 don't. How about that?

When you compare something, use statistics. And if you wish to show how .COM or .MOBI are worse, but my baby TEL domain is best, please be realistic. 

I am sorry, but I don't consider "mapping contact management to zonefiles" nothing special, no hard work, just basic programming. Many programmers could do that. All the tools are available. You use ready and available DNS server BIND9 and Delegate proxy for DNS, there are available tools for that, programmer just has to play "Lego" stones.

I cannot say if it is simple or complicated, really, that is matter of viewpoint. If one lacks knowledge and experience it is very complicated, vice versa, it is maybe very simple. 

Right now I manage DNS for some 300 domains, and I spend maybe 1 minute to setup a domain for Google Apps, setup various MX records, TXT (SPF) records and so on. If I have to, I would make database for that management. Within few hours. 

Then so many COM domains already have privacy features. And many have centralized exchange of keys. TEL is actually not centralized, but just trying to monopolize already available tools. 

TEL shall have open authentication protocols, and finally, it would grow in numbers, if friending could be achieved through Facebook, Twitter, Google, Yahoo, MSN, Open Authentications, and so on. That would actually grow the TEL business. So far EL is closed to that.

Dot TEL is a domain with included website. And we can say: TEL domain gives a website. But we cannot say that with TEL user need no website. That is not true.

Website by definition: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Website

No other domain gives you immediate website like TEL domain, it is simply wrong to use statement that with TEL domain you don't need a website. Those statements have been also argued on your marketing videos and that is one point which was not defined well, for PR purposes.

With TEL domain, user get his website. As simple as that. Without hassle, that is true. Without special hosting, that is true, and without web design, and so on.

But then again, we all get our websites like that on:

http://www.wix.com/ <-- good for Dot WIX proposal (With WIX you don't need a website)
Google Pages <--- good for Dot PAGES (with Dot PAGES you don't need a website)

Those are all websites. It does not matter if somebody provides "proxy" which reads DNS database and displays it, or if it is third party hosted, given, bought, designed, maintained, or self-created -- those are all websites. As long as someone by using URL can get to your information, it is website. Web site is collection of web pages, web pages are HTML and other stuff, and TEL domain has it all.[/size]

mactel03-02-2010 07:47 PM




Thank you so much, for your very interesting comments, Louis, as well as for the link to the useful wix.com website. All of your threads and posts, are higly appreciated, and I am very glad and happy to have you within the .tel community. You are probably something like the "Nikola Tesla of domaining, programming and computing", or like "Linus Torvalds", and always ahead of things, and suggesting the best solutions.
Just so grateful and lucky to know you...
That is how we can learn, and make our domains very useful and profitable. 

Anybody, who has "domain power", can make this world a better place, and that is probably the most efficient way to do it. By providing people with green goods and services, for building and using clean technology to produce low cost-, or free energy. 
No energy bills. 
Or by building a own house, cheaply, out of strawbales: No mortgage, and no rent, anymore. Finally, you can enjoy the money you earnt, spend it for good food (and tea) and wine, and buy real quality furniture, etc., and never be short of money, or out of pocket. Never be a working slave anymore. Be a free person. 
Thanks to the Internet, and efficient ways of using domains/websites/webpages. 
.

pink03-02-2010 08:36 PM




Quote:



Originally Posted by henri (Post 6018)
I understand that English isn't your mother tongue, so I will disregard certain unnecessarily aggressive statements, but in the future please do try to mollify your writing when you're uncertain about how it will be perceived.


[size]
I agree, theres no need for aggressive statements

peace[/size]

JLouisBiz03-02-2010 08:57 PM




Quote:



Oh, and take it on faith that the data has the correct structure because there's no guarantee. Good luck!


[size]
See this:
http://telname.com/forum/showpost.ph...32&postcount=2

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zY4cSbbXbE4

How reliable is that? Where is the 60 secs average? I refrain of updating TEL domain, when I see how faulty it is. Obviously, the reliable records are not synchronized and not ordered correctly in the background.

I open up a new subdomain, populate it by hand, and I wait for how much to have it updated, shown on Internet? As now, this one is not yet showing: http://jeff-mandel.caricaturist.tel/

And records on the front page get mixed up, some disappear simply, some delete appear suddenly, although they were deleted before hours. 

So much about reliability. Centralized software, centralized information, and user is left to pry the God to get it to work.[/size]

steved197503-05-2010 08:38 PM




Dear Henri,

Let me ask you politely. Can you kindly explain why the record updation isn't instantaneous?

Thanks,
Steve

mobiletel03-06-2010 08:35 AM




I have been building .mobi sites for two and a half years. I built my first .tel site today. In fact, where I have similar names, I was having difficulty deciding which to build out, and the .tel practically built itself because all I had to do was type in data.

Dot tel does not allow modification of source code, and it does not allow hosting of image files. .Mobi allows both, but everything needs to be built from scratch or with a mobile plugin for a cms.

I think end users who purchase dot tel's will have a much easier road to development, but with the tradeoff that it is not a full website and the options are limited.

Each has it's place, and both suffer at the hands of dot com domainers who either truly do think neither is needed or are protecting their own turf, or both.

My personal experience is engaging in these kinds of repetitive arguments on domainer forums is good for only one thing: determining one's own position in the matter. Once that's been decided, it's best to log out and stop arguing, and build sites. Anything else is a waste of time and energy in my humble opinion.

    Current date/time is Sun 19 Nov 2017, 10:48 pm