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An easy benchmark for the success of the .tel project!

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An easy benchmark for the success of the .tel project!

Post by Alex on Fri 31 Aug 2012, 5:31 am

As soon Telnic have convinced global players to use their .tel domains I believe the target for .tel is almost reached.

Therefore it is very easy to see the current status of the .tel project here:

http://apple.tel/
http://att.tel/
http://facebook.tel/
http://google.tel/
http://microsoft.tel/
http://nokia.tel/
http://samsung.tel/
http://skype.tel/
http://twitter.tel/
http://vodafone.tel/
http://yahoo.tel/
http://youtube.tel/

Just wait until you will find anything interesting on one of these domains. Then you know we are coming close to success.

(Apple is the only one who put at least a phone number on their .tel.)

Unfortunately as you can see by checking the .tel domains above, there is no value for bigger companies to use it.

The question is what has to change to create this value?


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Re: An easy benchmark for the success of the .tel project!

Post by telrific on Fri 31 Aug 2012, 6:09 am

That's an easy one, and one that was known and advertised "Day 1".

The Global Directory.

When there is a QUALITY single point of contact for everyone's single point of contact, we will have a reason and a simple place for everyone.

Get rid of the Sub-Domain GARBAGE and use the Frontpage only or a Telnames only Directory to show the "Card" of all Businesses and Individuals Globally.

AS WAS ADVERTISED (Fraudulently To Date) SINCE DAY ONE.

Fraudulent - Unjustifiably claiming particular qualities.
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Re: An easy benchmark for the success of the .tel project!

Post by mikeseaton on Fri 31 Aug 2012, 9:31 am

telrific wrote:Get rid of the Sub-Domain GARBAGE and use the Frontpage only or a Telnames only Directory to show the "Card" of all Businesses and Individuals Globally.
Well Telrific, you have just upset Power Users and Software Developers with your comment above - both of these groups need subdomains for them to have a continuing interest in .tels !

But I do believe you have a valid point - it is ridiculous to launch a "new" (to most people anyway) product on the internet with 2 versions that are as different as chalk and cheese i.e. the Telnic and Telnames versions of .tel.

Since it appears from all the evidence so far that the Telnames version of .tel is the only one that will ever be promoted by Telnic/Telnames, then it is time to offer ALL .tel users (whoever their registrar is) the Telnames template with it's benefits of user-input via the control panel of background image, video, image gallery and discount coupon.

Confusing newbies (particularly when there are alternatives, often free) with 2 versions is a crazy way to market a product.

Which would help explain the continuing fall in .tel total registrations (see http://www.teltalk.org/t405-how-to-convince-telcos-about-name-dialing#1697).

Will Telnic/Telnames grasp the nettle and finally sort this mess out ?

http://MiikeSeaton.tel
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Re: An easy benchmark for the success of the .tel project!

Post by telrific on Fri 31 Aug 2012, 9:49 am

No intelligent User could be upset or insulted by that comment, it says directory use of Subdomains.

When you sell a product (domain name) and offer a directory to find a business or individual with that product, a .tel domain, that is what the directory should be .... period.

If "Power Users and Software Developers" use sub-domains AFTER they are discovered in the TelPages Directory as Advertised, AND AS I DO, so be it.

There is NO reason to have a .tel domain directory including more than the ".tel domain frontpage" - This is why TelPages is a JOKE and no one cares about anything

that was advertised DAY ONE AND NEVER ACCOMPLISHED.

You will never see those real companies mixing their billion-dollar brands with the GARBAGE SUBDOMAINS in TelPages today, and yet a QUALITY single point of contact for all single point of contacts is STILL the key to success.
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Re: An easy benchmark for the success of the .tel project!

Post by kprobe on Fri 31 Aug 2012, 10:14 am

Interesting. I never thought of this angle until now. One of the failings of Telpages is that it refuses by design (who knows) to index NAPTR records. THese are the contact records that the public needs. Telpages is not indexed by Google et al, probably because these NAPTR records are not indexed. One reason I assume is because of the sheer volume if TP would ever index everything including all data on subdomains. If all the information was present on the first page, then TP would do a much better job. However with professional-level Tel domains, contact information is scattered across subdomains like "Contact Information" or "Social Information" as well as other mostly non-contact folders. That makes it difficult to distinguish the "wheat from the chaff". Telnames templates do in fact make it easier to find everything. Perhaps there is a plan to index NAPTR on Telnames as these are more suited to the original concept with more quality on the first and only page.

But I still am a believer in the subdomain concept to segregate information for small business. Not all information belongs on the first page. Testimonials for example shouldn't be mixed on page one. Neither should details like biographies and product descriptions. Like it or not, small businesses benefit from pro .tel, non Telnames, as well. I've helped set up several SMB and they all use subdomains.

Mark
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Re: An easy benchmark for the success of the .tel project!

Post by kprobe on Fri 31 Aug 2012, 10:26 am

Informational sites are another reason to index all contact info on subdomains. They are easy to assemble and mobile ready. Look at this article re NLD Crisis Tel. A perfect example of why .Tel subdomain NAPTR records need to be indexed by Telpages.
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Re: An easy benchmark for the success of the .tel project!

Post by telrific on Fri 31 Aug 2012, 10:40 am

There is no good reason to index subdomain information, period.

When any intelligent person seeks information they go to the authority, or author, the primary source where and when available.

If I want Microsoft information I go to Microsoft, not any one of a million garbage results of copycats reprinting Microsoft information, unless those copycats have proven something.

If I don't know where Microsoft is located for example, and I don't know the official website, I might use Google to find out.

At that point I don't want a billion results of copycats reprinting information as Google garbage of the Microsoft effort either.

I will select the Microsoft website and use the OWNER information, exactly why Google strives for the authority, and the top results are most often chosen.

TelPages and .TEL is no different.

Sub-Domains have a place when and if the OWNER chooses to provide it AFTER the primary result is provided in the Directory.

If this SUB-Directory information is included as a .tel subdomain, or simple redirection to a .com or .microsoft or whatever, then so be it, at the OWNER'S discretion AFTER the Directory results, and as the OWNER chooses to provide the information, not the directory indexing.

GIVING THE OWNER'S PRIMARY INFORMATION HAS ALWAYS PROVEN TO BE THE DEMAND AND THE SUCCESS.

TelPages and .TEL have never respected this reality, but Yellow Pages, YELP, Google, etc. all have and are in demand as a result.
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Re: An easy benchmark for the success of the .tel project!

Post by kprobe on Fri 31 Aug 2012, 10:55 am

When you have several departments in a small business, says Sales vs Support, it certainly makes sense to have a subdomain(s) for contact information. You get a logical segregation by what the visitor needs. Cluttering the main page with contacts doesn't make visual or logical sense. Even with a Telnames template, there is a need for specialized subdomains and you probably will start seeing that added as a Telnames feature in the future.

I agree with your statement about copycats. I've been advocating for years to have Telpages broker only original contact information on behalf of .Tel owners and have directories that simply point to other .Tel domains instead of replicating information that will change.

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Re: An easy benchmark for the success of the .tel project!

Post by telrific on Fri 31 Aug 2012, 11:03 am

kprobe wrote:When you have several departments in a small business, says Sales vs Support, it certainly makes sense to have a subdomain(s) for contact information. You get a logical segregation by what the visitor needs. Cluttering the main page with contacts doesn't make visual or logical sense. Even with a Telnames template, there is a need for specialized subdomains and you probably will start seeing that added as a Telnames feature in the future. ...

This has nothing to do with what I wrote above however.

Subdomains are always warranted by the Owner, and provided by the Owner if and when chosen by the Owner, as the Owner sees fit, .tel, .com., voice directory, operator, etc.

This has NOTHING to do with the provision of a single piece of information as a DIRECTORY result and indexing alone, my point above.

The user will ALWAYS have access to SUB-PRIMARY information regardless of how the Owner provides it, but should NEVER be done until AFTER the primary result ALONE for Directory PROVEN value.
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Re: An easy benchmark for the success of the .tel project!

Post by kprobe on Fri 31 Aug 2012, 11:56 am

I'm confused by your response ...
This has NOTHING to do with the provision of a single piece of
information as a DIRECTORY result and indexing alone, my point above.

If the valid contact information is in the subdomain, then Telpages needs to index it and provide it as the initial directory result from a search.

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Re: An easy benchmark for the success of the .tel project!

Post by telrific on Fri 31 Aug 2012, 12:17 pm

kprobe wrote:I'm confused by your response ...
This has NOTHING to do with the provision of a single piece of
information as a DIRECTORY result and indexing alone, my point above.

If the valid contact information is in the subdomain, then Telpages needs to index it and provide it as the initial directory result from a search.

And that is the exact wrong thinking that makes TelPages useless and the directory not in demand, with few listings, i.e. domain registrations.

Very simple to understand and I'll use some examples that started this thread:

Apple

AT&T

Facebook

Google



Domain Registration:

Apple.tel

ATT.tel

Facebook.tel

Google.tel

TelPages:

Apple.tel

ATT.tel

Facebook.tel

Google.tel

Period.

If Apple.tel selects a .tel that has subdomains, fine, but they should NEVER directly appear as indexed confusion in TelPages results, Apple.tel will have everything needed to begin with.

If ATT.tel selects to have a direct link to the ATT.com contact directory, fine, and they should NEVER directly appear as indexed confusion in TelPages results. ATT.tel will have everything needed to begin with.

If Facebook.tel selects to employ an Operator to service Facebook customers, fine, but she should NEVER directly appear as indexed confusion in TelPages results, Facebook.tel will have everything that is needed to begin with.


If Google.tel selects all the above, fine, but they should NEVER directly appear as indexed confusion in TelPages results, Google.tel has everything that is needed to begin with.



Key phrase: "needed to begin with."

This is Telnic's failing, it is not focused as the beginning of beginnings, this is the whole key to the success. (OWNER indexed thereafter.)

Yellow Pages got it, Yelp gets it, Google knows it all too well ... It's just too bad everyone gets it but the Telnic crowd (for the most part).
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Re: An easy benchmark for the success of the .tel project!

Post by mikeseaton on Fri 31 Aug 2012, 5:57 pm

Interesting discussion, but probably irrelevant unless and until Telnic puts a TelPages search box on http://telnic.org and http://ilovemytel.com

Myself and Mark suggested this on Telnic's forum (see http://telnic.org/forum/showthread.php?t=1981) - Nadya thought it was a very good idea - you can tell how far back this goes since Nadya left Telnic a long time ago !

As usual nothing actually happened, so if newbies to .tel visiting http://telnic.org and/or http://ilovemytel.com aren't made aware of the existence of TelPages as a search engine it doesn't really matter how good or bad it is !

I know they can come across a TelPages search box as part of a .tel domain, but it needs to be shouted from the rooftops as the official .tel search engine by http://telnic.org and http://ilovemytel.com

Or of course you could just use http://www.net-link.com/tel to search .tel domains !

http://MikeSeaton.tel
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Re: An easy benchmark for the success of the .tel project!

Post by Rambo on Fri 31 Aug 2012, 6:24 pm

Why we should search .tel domains at all? They have no meaning, no coverage and most of them have not even content!
After 3,5 years it's time Telnic realizes an innovative technology is not enough to draw attention. Requirements are improvement, marketing and industrial relationships; but Telnic's staff seems to consist of [Inappropriate word deleted! - The admin].
So hire a REAL specialist and lead the product to success!!That's all it takes!
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Re: An easy benchmark for the success of the .tel project!

Post by mikeseaton on Fri 31 Aug 2012, 6:29 pm

Rambo wrote:So hire a REAL specialist and lead the product to success!!
These guys with a proven track record could do just that for .tel - see http://rightofthedot.com and http://rightofthedot.com/about

Again suggested to Telnic on their forum but ignored as usual - probably Monte Cahn and Michael Berkens are now too busy with many of the 1000+ new gTLDs being launched soon as new clients !

http://MikeSeaton.tel
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Re: An easy benchmark for the success of the .tel project!

Post by Rambo on Fri 31 Aug 2012, 6:46 pm

Yes Mike, you're right again!
I don't want to offend the guys at Telnic, because they try their best. They just don't know how to play the big game. Instead they prefer baking small roles.
Telnic is sitting on gold and doesn't dare to open eyes.
Telnic should hire somebody who knows the market. Every penny spent for that is worth 10 times more than the salary of every employee!
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Re: An easy benchmark for the success of the .tel project!

Post by telrific on Sat 01 Sep 2012, 5:17 am

mikeseaton wrote:Interesting discussion, but probably irrelevant unless and until ...

The only thing irrelevant is all the GARBAGE talk when there are only two simple, quality things that everyone intelligent has understood since day one:

1. Quality .TEL Listing

2. Quality TelPages Directory

This is what got everyone excited when the idea started, and why everyone that has a brain has bailed on Telnic when they proved that they had no REAL intention of looking like a professional effort.

Unless and until this is recognized like every other intelligent effort that has and does exist SUCCESSFULLY, all the other talk is minor, pointless, and uninteresting ... still.

3+ years head start AFTER ICANN approval and there are new efforts that are kicking Telnic's butt in their own town using the above simple understanding.

If we're going to have a plethora of templates, with or without subdomains, Telnic had better recognize that TelPages and the overall success of the effort depends on the Frontpage-Only directory to "pull it all together" for the "2." above.

Telnic, Telnames, TelChina, Etc. -- TelPages Global Directory had better get a clue and come up with the "Mortar" for the "Brickface" of all of them.
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Re: An easy benchmark for the success of the .tel project!

Post by telrific on Sat 01 Sep 2012, 5:56 am

mikeseaton wrote: ... Telnic puts a TelPages search box on http://telnic.org and http://ilovemytel.com

When Telnic realizes that just like Yellow Pages, Yelp, Google, Etc. that the Directory IS the starting point to everything else, not an addition to what they don't care about, there is hope.

Facebook could learn a thing or two about that and maybe they wouldn't be dying too ! Glad I didn't fall for that IPO !
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Re: An easy benchmark for the success of the .tel project!

Post by Telomat on Sat 01 Sep 2012, 5:59 am

telrific wrote:When Telnic realizes that just like Yellow Pages, Yelp, Google, Etc. that the Directory IS the starting point to everything else, not an addition to what they don't care about, there is hope.
How we can convince Telnic about it, since they hardly accept any advice?
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Re: An easy benchmark for the success of the .tel project!

Post by telrific on Sat 01 Sep 2012, 7:14 am

Telomat wrote:
telrific wrote:When Telnic realizes that just like Yellow Pages, Yelp, Google, Etc. that the Directory IS the starting point to everything else, not an addition to what they don't care about, there is hope.
How we can convince Telnic about it, since they hardly accept any advice?

Good question, you figure that one out let me know.

I, along with other intelligent people (who have long since gone), have been beating the "TelPages is the key" drum since 2009 .... Deaf ears.

Most unintelligent people seem to think that unless every Business and Individual on the planet has a .tel there is no point. (see 2nd word)

So the geniuses decided that it's better to stuff a bunch of domains with non-Owner garbage themselves and start a Landfill instead ... brilliant, eh ?

I found this article in the Local Search Association news since I first commented in this thread; How timely is this to this discussion of subdomains and content stuffers ?

http://streetfightmag.com/2012/08/29/why-are-local-search-results-polluted-with-bad-content
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Re: An easy benchmark for the success of the .tel project!

Post by mikeseaton on Sat 01 Sep 2012, 7:55 am

Telomat wrote:
telrific wrote:When Telnic realizes that just like Yellow Pages, Yelp, Google, Etc. that the Directory IS the starting point to everything else, not an addition to what they don't care about, there is hope.
How we can convince Telnic about it, since they hardly accept any advice?
You can't (based on experience) convince Telnic of anything - simple as that !

So the only way forward is to reduce your financial/time involvement with .tel (as many of us are now doing) and/or modify your business activities to accept that the Telnames template (as shown by http://YourBusiness.tel) is the only public face of .tel that will ever be marketed and promoted from now on !

It's called being realistic and pragmatic - a necessary attitude for business survival !

http://MikeSeaton.tel
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Re: An easy benchmark for the success of the .tel project!

Post by telrific on Sat 01 Sep 2012, 8:59 am

mikeseaton wrote:You can't (based on experience) convince Telnic of anything - simple as that !


http://MikeSeaton.tel

One certainly can't argue too much with that statement, though Telnames certainly includes suggestions I personally made to Kash back in 2009, and though argued against by him at a time when there was just a white card with a light purple background, there it is today, a picture background and suggestions that TelpagesPlus was promoting for years, video, gallery, etc.

It still needs to be more than just about business though, and without the parade of many personal Telnames listed here, you can't deny that personal is valuable too, just look at Huw's daughter Xanthe, what a cutie, and she has her's for life - Xanthe.tel (as do me and mine using both types of .tel templates - Vanderhorst.tel )
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Re: An easy benchmark for the success of the .tel project!

Post by marimax on Sat 01 Sep 2012, 7:04 pm

"When Telnic realizes that just like Yellow Pages, Yelp, Google, Etc. that the Directory IS the starting point to everything else, not an addition to what they don't care about, there is hope"

As much as I don't like Telnic I can not blame them for everything. This whole idea started as a simple and easy to use webpage and now you guys (computer specialists)are trying to ruin it. Why don't you just turn it into a regular webpage with hosting, web developing and so on and we will be like .com. net, org, info.............

We don't need new templates, all we need is one template, ability to change background colours, add pictures and video and most of all ability to accept payments and people who understand the concept behind .tel or KISS (keep it simple stupid) I don't understand people who register names like new-year, smartbizz, coffee ,whatshallicallmywebsite and so on when at the same time domains like for example londondoctors, dentists, lawyers, painters and so on remain unregistered and undeveloped. Multiply these by number of cities and businesses and professions around the world and you have millions of .tel domains in use. When we have these domains you will not have to go to Google to find anything, simply type in www.denverdoctors.tel to find a doctor in Denver or any city+profession or business. Once people get used to it .tel will become popular world wide and will replace Yellow Pages as a main source of busienss contact information
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Re: An easy benchmark for the success of the .tel project!

Post by Tel on Sat 01 Sep 2012, 7:18 pm

marimax wrote:When we have these domains you will not have to go to Google to find anything, simply type in www.denverdoctors.tel to find a doctor in Denver or any city+profession or business. Once people get used to it .tel will become popular world wide and will replace Yellow Pages as a main source of busienss contact information
I guess that is the goal we are waiting for; but that would need two things: A) .tel domain owners who put valuable content on CityProfession.tel and B) education of internet users to use it. B should follow automatically after data can be found on all imaginary .tel domains for A, but who pays the money to register and create the .tel domains for A? The problem is domain investors won't do A before .tel is successful and .tel won't be successful before domain investors do A!

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Re: An easy benchmark for the success of the .tel project!

Post by JH on Sat 01 Sep 2012, 7:21 pm

Tel wrote:who pays the money to register and create the .tel domains for A?
mikeseaton wrote:The best solution, given where we are 3.5 years after .tel's launch, is to take a leaf out of Facebook's successful formula and give .tels away for free (see *) with Telnic making money from advertising and perhaps a premium (ad free) chargeable version.

Advertising brings in billions a year for Facebook from their "free" accounts and this approach has made an incredible number of Facebook staff multi-millionaires and at least one under-30 year old a billionaire !

* "free" for a minimum of 1 or 2 years, possibly indefinitely depending on ad revenue.
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Re: An easy benchmark for the success of the .tel project!

Post by telrific on Sat 01 Sep 2012, 8:32 pm

marimax wrote:As much as I don't like Telnic I can not blame them for everything. This whole idea started as a simple and easy to use webpage and now you guys (computer specialists)are trying to ruin it. Why don't you just turn it into a regular webpage with hosting, web developing and so on and we will be like .com. net, org, info.............

We don't need new templates, all we need is one template, ability to change background colours, add pictures and video and most of all ability to accept payments and people who understand the concept behind .tel or KISS (keep it simple stupid)

That is exactly right !

I don't understand people who register names like new-year, smartbizz, coffee ,whatshallicallmywebsite and so on when at the same time domains like for example londondoctors, dentists, lawyers, painters and so on remain unregistered and undeveloped. Multiply these by number of cities and businesses and professions around the world and you have millions of .tel domains in use. When we have these domains you will not have to go to Google to find anything, simply type in www.denverdoctors.tel to find a doctor in Denver or any city+profession or business. Once people get used to it .tel will become popular world wide and will replace Yellow Pages as a main source of busienss contact information.

This is also correct, however, you will always need TelPages in addition to the likes of denverdoctors.tel

A. Businesses and Individuals have their .tel registration ( Names )

B. Locating that .tel for a Business or Individual will always be necessary alone ( TelPages.com to discover the above registrations )

C. Geographical and Categorical ( Keyword/Keyphrase ) .tel (sub)directories that use the OWNER updated .tel's from A. above are eventually valuable, such as denverdoctors.tel

As soon as the first .tel domain registrations existed, TelPages was needed to list them and show them, and sort order is necessary, second level only, no subdomains. ( IndividualName.tel and BusinessName.tel )

As soon as enough .tel registrations could/can be grouped, keyword/keyphrase domains are valuable. ( DenverDoctors.tel and LondonTaxis.tel )

We have A., but not B. (as needed), so no C.

A quality TelPages to drive discoverability and registrations is the viral need for all .tel's

Without looking it up anywhere, tell me from memory the .tel addresses of all Telnic members and the Telnic forum members.

Right, TelPages.com was necessary day 2, with top page registrations only.

The forum has a better member directory than TelPages does for .tel registrants.

Reliable discoverability of .tel registrants without garbage is the critical, missing link ... still.

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